A Complete Waste of Space

Reservoir_Dog wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2017 12:26 pm Don't know if you've seen this one, Slick. It's a good read.

https://www.recode.net/2017/3/25/150513 ... automation

never read it yet, but speaks to what I've been talking about. We're set up to take a massive hit(should nail China hard, too, at a bad time), and are doing ZERO to prepare for it.

Reservoir_Dog wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:40 pm

HappyHappy wrote: Sun Jun 11, 2017 4:27 pm To work in manufacturing is has already changed the role
of a worker into being maintainers and programmers.

True. But due to automation 50 workers can be replaced by 1 maintainer or programmer.

Agreed, but that happened 2 hundred years with the punch card programmable loom and steam power.
NC took off 50 years ago with the Pratt&Whitney TRIAX and has only been enhanced with faster more modern machines.
NC machines are nothing more than metal working robots.

3D Printing is the new god. It will eventually replace nearly EVERYTHING.

None of us remember when garments were so expensive
that people repaired everything they wore, even socks.
Have you seen a cobbler lately? They still exist but are rare.

Manufacturing automation makes people more equal. Manufacturing automation makes
otherwise ultra expensive electronics and machines(cars for instance) cheap.

Because of automation you are living better than Carnegie or Rockefeller
could have dreamed of a hundred years ago.

Their dreams of the future are now a reality because of many things
but in no small part because of automation.

Robotics are here to stay.

And YOU are better off because of it.


Allan Sherman – Automation Lyrics 1963!!!

It was automation, I know.
That was what was making the factory go.
It was IBM, it was Univac.
It was all those gears going clickety-clack, dear.
I thought automation was keen,
Till you were replaced by a ten ton machine.
It was that computer that tore us apart, dear.
Automation broke my heart.
There's an RCA 503
Standing next to me where you used to be.
Doesn't have your smile, doesn't have your shape.
Just a bunch of punch cards and light bulbs and tape, dear.
You're a girl who's soft, warm and sweet.
But you're only human, and that's obsolete.
Though I'm very fond of that 503, dear,
Automation's not for me.
It was automation, I'm told.
That's why I got fired, and I'm out in the cold.
How could I have known, when the 503
Started into blink, it was winking at me, dear.
I thought it was just some mishap,
When it sidled over and sat on my lap.
But when it said "I love you" and gave me a hug, dear, That's when I pulled out its plug!

no argument that you LIVE better thanks to the progress in automation, it's just that you're about to see automation take out actual labor. As Res' article notes, a CONSERVATIVE estimate is that 40% of all available jobs will be gone in a decade. Before, and I think you mistyped to suggest that the US had 'punch cards' in 1817, there were more and cheaper finished goods thanks to the first and second industrial revolutions. The third, around microelectronics made life easier for most, BUT came with the cost of developed world jobs, as it became increasingly easier to outsource to low cost wage centers. This next one, I'm telling you honestly, Happy, is NOT GOING TO BE THE SAME, This is an automation/AI revolution. You talk about 3D printing as if that is some sort of pinnacle. That is NOTHING. Imagine those printers, fed AI generated designs, with assembly done by robotics. Imaging AI creations whose role is to learn quickly and then TEACH other AI creations. My hardcore geek friends project a loss for the need of around 80% of all human labor, worldwide, in about 15 years. That requres a couple of things from every society that wishes to benefit from this:

1. A willingness to redefine human worth away from mere employment or work
2. A committment to open trade globally, as that will be a norm that will be expected of any commercial venture
3. A committment to revamping the very nature of higher education(past elementary school).
4. A willingness to accept that the investor class(about 10% tops of our nation, for example) HAS to share their income(which should skyrocket) with the rest of the population.
5. Along with #4, there will have to be a serious effort at REDUCING the size of the human population.

Now, that was more than a couple. But, more important, those are MASSIVE hurdles, huge tasks for a society to deal with and a massive amount of sheer change. Do YOU think we are prepared, as a nation to do those things? I don't see it now, whereas I do see a few nations FULLY preparing for that future, and those needs.

HappyHappy wrote: Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:57 pm Robotics are here to stay.

Precisely. That's the entire point of this thread.

the part you don't explain is how YOU, Slappy will be better off. How? Are you possessed of enough of a portfolio to profit from the investments? If so, how do you deal with the 90% of your fellow citizens who are not in that position when the jobs go away? If not, how exactly is your future 'better off'? Do you need your employment income to live?

HappyHappy wrote: Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:57 pm Robotics are here to stay.

And YOU are better off because of it.

sure i am, personally. I'm poised to make millions if all goes well. That doesn't address how the society as a whole makes out, and that seriously affects my family's future well-being, as money isn't everything.

for the matter of clarification, a great deal of the reason you can buy more 'stuff' for personal luxury usage, Happy, is because you and many of your fellow citizens have been willing, wholesale, to abandon domestic produced goods. Enjoy the fruits of paying Chinese workers a few cents an hour? Able to buy a car because half of the vehicle is from outside the US, no matter where assembled? Cheap computers from Asian chip fabrication? You are benefitting from others who've paid the price via cheap labor. Let's see how you make out, when YOUR labor value is nonexistant, because that day is coming. What do you do for a living, Happy?

Urgh......

It's coming....and it's coming without a safety net. People will adapt....they always have.
Worse case scenario? Them Pro Choice folks may be able to prove their argument.

Just curious? Which is more important? The impending 'Skynet' or Global Warming/Climate Change?
Or has Skynet been designated the new crisis?

Pudfark wrote: Mon Jun 12, 2017 6:53 pm Urgh......

It's coming....and it's coming without a safety net. People will adapt....they always have.
Worse case scenario? Them Pro Choice folks may be able to prove their argument.

Just curious? Which is more important? The impending 'Skynet' or Global Warming/Climate Change?
Or has Skynet been designated the new crisis?

two separate issues, both important.