why I hate Liberals,

[HappyHappy]

Until the supreme court strikes that communist piece of shit
down I will be a criminal. I will refuse to pay any fines.
Fuck Pelosi and Obama.

The IRS has no teeth, can not collect.

SCREW Osama Obama and his minions.

HH

[callmeslick]

Until the supreme court strikes that communist piece of shit
down I will be a criminal. I will refuse to pay any fines.
Fuck Pelosi and Obama.

The IRS has no teeth, can not collect.

SCREW Osama Obama and his minions.

HH

question: do you currently have health insurance?

[callmeslick]

What's really odd about some folks(er, Ruggbutt) and their attitudes is this: The current setup is far worse for almost everyone. Every day in this country, tons of folks with no insurance, and no means to pay for care show up at hospitals nationwide. The Feds, due to a law passed during the Nixon administration, reimburse some of the free care those folks receive. The difference, and it is substantial, gets passed along to paying customers(via insurance or out of pocket) in the form of exhorbitant fees, such as $400/day room charges,
$100 bags of sucrose/saline drips, $8 aspirins and the like. The principle behind mandatory insurance is that
by requiring insurance, reimbursement will be steady, without gaps and delays which further add to expenses,and a far greater amount of the billing will be paid for.
The way I see it, no matter if the law does or doesn't exactly lead to major reforms, I am going to get hosed less, because the hospital reimbursement from tax monies will be drastically reduced. The $3000 opt-out fee is to allow for a fund that will compensate the hospitals if someone(say, Ruggie or HappyHappy) is so stupid as to not get insurance, and then encounter a medical expense they cannot pay for. I really don't see the problem, nor any reason to get worked up over the whole deal. Oh, that ideology thing again?? That explains it.......

[ruggbutt]

The way the healthcare law is written, you can opt out. You just have to pay a fee that goes into a fund to pay hospitals for unreinbursed expenses

Yep, I have to pay the extortion so that I'm not arrested. WTF, are we gonna have debtors prison again?

don't ask me to pay for it, when you go to a hospital or clinic. Because, right now, I do.

I've never asked anyone to pay my way, ever. And stop being a martyr. We all pay for shit for other people and you're one of the guys here who says he has no problems doing so. You've reiterated that time and time again. So what you need to do is STFU cuz you agree with doing all this shit.

Every day in this country, tons of folks with no insurance, and no means to pay for care show up at hospitals nationwide.

Yep, and those hospitals are called Free Clinics. They're usually run by the county. And since they're free (and Obama care will be for many) you'll have douchebags fucking up all the real hospitals by clogging the emergency rooms cuz they have a headache or need a band aid.

The $3000 opt-out fee is to allow for a fund that will compensate the hospitals if someone(say, Ruggie or HappyHappy) is so stupid as to not get insurance, and then encounter a medical expense they cannot pay for.

You do realize what many of us blue collar workers did 20 years ago if we had to go to the emergency room, don't ya? We paid the bill. Unfortunately your party has been instrumental in telling folks that they aren't responsible for their actions nor do they have to pay their bills. Too many hand outs. Seriously dude, how many people on welfare do you think actually cannot work? Even when the economy is good? Generations of Americans on the tit of the Democrats' social programs................

I really don't see the problem, nor any reason to get worked up over the whole deal. Oh, that ideology thing again?? That explains it.......

Yeah, I expect that you just don't get the whole Constitutional thing. You've insinuated you've done some greasy shit in your past. People like that don't really have much of that "ideology thing". What's funny is you don't get it Slick. While it may not apply to you, your government is forcing every American into a third party contract or they become a criminal. And the thing that should be funny but it's not is that universal health care will apply to illegals. Free medical has always been part of what this country does, and now your party is figuring out a way for the rest of us to pay for them or end up with a criminal record.

Nice!! As much as I think the Republicans are sleazy fuckers for backing the Patriot Act, your party is far worse. As it criminalizes every American who refuses to be forced into a thrid party contract. It doesn't matter if it's a contract for free medicine or a contract for free chicken McNuggets. It's unconstitutional. For someone who loves to point out his family has been here since before the country started you sure don't have a goddamned clue about what this country is all about.

It ain't about handouts. East coast fag.

[callmeslick]

Yep, I have to pay the extortion so that I'm not arrested. WTF, are we gonna have debtors prison again?

I'm all for it. And, indentured servitude as well.

Yep, and those hospitals are called Free Clinics. They're usually run by the county. And since they're free (and Obama care will be for many) you'll have douchebags fucking up all the real hospitals by clogging the emergency rooms cuz they have a headache or need a band aid.

maybe out your way it's different, but that is exactly how general Hospitals have been used in the East
for years.

You do realize what many of us blue collar workers did 20 years ago if we had to go to the emergency room, don't ya? We paid the bill. Unfortunately your party has been instrumental in telling folks that they aren't responsible for their actions nor do they have to pay their bills. Too many hand outs. Seriously dude, how many people on welfare do you think actually cannot work? Even when the economy is good? Generations of Americans on the tit of the Democrats' social programs................

first off, thanks to a Dem bill, no one can receive welfare for more than 5 years anymore. Been law for 15 years. Yes, I realize how it was with some(not many, imo, due to Unionization here in civilization) blue collar workers. Part of the issue has become that many of them cannot afford the huge fees anymore. I laid out the causes for much of those huge fees. Now, you can continue to stick your head in the sand, or up your ass and hope it all goes away, but it won't without some serious re-arrangement.

Nice!! As much as I think the Republicans are sleazy fuckers for backing the Patriot Act, your party is far worse. As it criminalizes every American who refuses to be forced into a thrid party contract. It doesn't matter if it's a contract for free medicine or a contract for free chicken McNuggets. It's unconstitutional. For someone who loves to point out his family has been here since before the country started you sure don't have a goddamned clue about what this country is all about.

when my ancestors were settling their little piece of turf, they HAD to be self-reliant. But, times change. Sure, the nation once was capable of community based programs that made sure all were covered(sort of like the Amish, a kind of communal system). Today, for various reasons, there is less spirit of community, things have become corporatized and impersonal. Somehow, we have to have a system to deal with it. What the 'country is all about' is the ongoing process of making life better for all citizens(pursuit of Happiness, etc).
The founders gave a very malleable document that helps achieve that end. Nothing in the healthcare bill goes against those principles. Personally, I would have avoided the mandatory purchase thing and simply extended Medicare to all, but a certain party wouldn't go for that one.....

It ain't about handouts. East coast fag.

and yet, you whine about handouts constantly. Heat-addled loon.

[Jumoschwanz]

I don't like the idea of mandated anything. I want the right to not wear a seatbelt or motorcycle helmet, I think a FREE man should be just that, once he is say, 18 years old, should be able to do what he wants even if it risks his life.

NOW, I am not saying that my thoughts are right or left wing, I do not think they have anything to do with a political party at all.

Take car insurance for instance. Why is it mandatory? It is mandatory because the rich DO think driving is a right and not a privledge. When I drive a car around, I would like to do it without any insurance. I accept fully the risks involved. I weigh the benefit provided by the transportation it provides against the fact that I may be maimed, killed or that my car may be smashed to bits and lost, and that is no problem to me, bring it on!

I am not afraid to drive without car insurance because I am a fantastic and intelligent driver, I BELONG on the road. Also, my car is very practical, if it is smashed and ruined it is not a big deal because the whole vehicle can be replaced for a few thousand dollars, I am not going to lose $50-$100K because I am some moron that paid that much for a car.

Now to the rich and powerful, who need to be seen driving around in $100K cars and SUVs, the rich and powerful who for driving is a RIGHT whether they are bad drivers, or drunk or high or just plain stupid, THEY need their society, the society they shape and run, to have insurance and other safeguards so they can go about being their morons selves and not have ANY CONSEQUENCES for their actions!

The rich and powerful can go about their day being stupid, they can risk their lives and property and go against the odds because they can not lose. They can not lose because they make the laws and rules in their society and they force everyone, even those who do not need it, to buy car insurance so that when they have bad luck everyone pays for it. They have no responsibility at all.

As far as health insurance goes, or any insurance for that matter, the only reason it exists at all is to make many people very wealthy, it is just a big scam. If THE PEOPLE of the United States took the money that they give to insurance companies into a non-profit fund or account that collected any interest at all, we would all be able to take all the money we wanted out of it for medical bills and car repairs that we needed and it would NEVER go bankrupt at all. In fact after it accrued to a certain level it would be self-sustaining and we would not even have to put any more money into it.

That is how rotten and inefficient insurance companies are. They are pigs, taking money from citizens, stuffing it in the pockets of executives and the richer shareholders. It is literally a stuck-hog, bleeding the countries wealth into the rich and powerfuls overseas bank accounts.

So again, those here who argue partisan politics are morons, as ANY problem this country has is nothing to do with anything but rich and powerful people who are exploiting you and taking advantage of their position over yours.

The only reason to think in terms of partisan politics is that you are too dumb to do anything else. Partisan politics is a ruse created and sustained by the powerful to keep the general population busy and distracted so they can do as they please, and you are falling right into line where they want you to, you fucking morons......

[ruggbutt]

RE Car Insurance: I've been hit by idiots who don't have insurance. It's a good thing I did cuz they didn't assume their responsibility as an adult.

[GOYA]

The laws for car insurance is only for liability. Imagine if the federal govt mandated that everyone carry full coverage auto insurance.

[callmeslick]

what the whole healthcare thing comes down to is this central question: Is basic healthcare a birthright of all citizens or a for-profit business available only to those that can afford it? Until that is settled, we'll wallow around, here in the US, someplace in the middle, with the government subsidizing some stuff, paying for other stuff, and folks sometimes falling through the cracks and going bankrupt for getting sick or injured. Now, I am firmly of the opinion that it ought to be a birthright, but I can't sit here and say any one of you is WRONG because you philosophically disagree. What all in the debate have failed to do, over the past century, is establish a consensus around either side of that argument. Which, in turn leads to halfway measures like the recently passed bill. Medicare for all wouldn't even raise the slightest suggestion of a Constitutional question, but that would require acceptance by a decent majority that all of us are entitled to healthcare services.

BTW, I state this as a long-time employee of a major, international healthcare company. We make a huge profit in the US annually, around 22% margin is what we aim for. And, it's that 22% margin, from all the providers, coupled with the profit margins needed to keep the pharmaceutical and insurance stockholders happy, that explains why US healthcare costs 50% more per person than in Europe, for example.

[callmeslick]

oh, and I'm off for a week of trout fishing in the mountains. Any lack of response is not an intentional slight, but reflects the fact that I'm living in a cabin with no interweb or even TV.